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Message: 11 Date: Wed, 14 Apr 1999 14:04:28 -0600 From: jar@xxxxxxx.xx.xxxxxxxxxxxx.xxxxxxxx) Subject: Re: Kevorkian I have always felt that Centaurs have a lot to do with life after death (or "life after life"), euthanasia, and the like, as trespassers they are. The Kevorkian case is a good study subject. I don't know the birth date, but Zane's post says he is 70 years old, and he also gave me the following birth positions: Chiron 7,23 Taurus
From this I can derive that he was born May 26, 1928. I find the following Centaur picture (noon GMT): Mercury 26,43 Gemini
According to Zane, Dr. Kevorkian 1st assisted suicide happened June 4, 1990. That day, a grand cross was formed in perfect symmetry with the above: QM107 27,41 Sagittarius (prec.corr.)
Pholus was in 0,42 Cancer, in opposition to itself in 0,24 Capricorn. Yesterday, when he was sentenced, Nessus was here (0,14 Capricorm precession-corrected). There are many other relationships that can be figured out, but, if this is really the correct date of "Dr. Death", it would be an excellent example of the type of things associated with Centaurs. /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 12
I'm sorry, there's one more impressive connection I forgot to mention. His progressed Sun (converse, or the solar arc direction of the other point) has been in conjunction with: DW2 1996-1998
These 2 centaurs are in close conjunction at birth, so they are conjunct the Sun during the trial and conviction, right now. Too bad we still have so little about the meaning of these... /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 4
I just realized that Venus in 3 Gemini is exactly in opposition to Chiron. In the way I deal with aspects, this opposition overthrowns tines and sextiles, although it is a reality that I tend to overemphasize the hard aspects, and maybe I am wrong. But the Venus oppostion Chiron looks as a perfect image of Rose Hill to me. Kevorkian has an exact conjunction of Mars and Uranus in Aries, and from reading Zane's post, it seems that his agressiveness and defiance of the law is what he had to pay for, not the euthanasia. Euthanasia and pain-relief of the terminally ill, ultimately, is born out of love and of the right of the person to die decently and in peace, a Venusian thing. Kervokian's Venus, by the way, is in 25 Taurus, squaring Neptune in 26 Leo. His Sun, in 4 or 5 Sagittarius, is or is going to be transited by Chiron in opposition... Venus has a lot to do with death, not as tragedy or separation, but as consummation and fulfilment of love. This new mass-awareness about death and the caring of the terminally ill, historically and culturally boosted by AIDS and Cancer, together with all the compassion and the understanding that has come about regarding taboos like homosexuality and incest or abuse, is the product of the Centaurs. Centaurs like CU26 and QM107 are a little more "gentle" --if that is possible for a centaur. They are feminine, and have a lot to do with this. They are still "crazy" and abnormal, but have "rounder" orbits. I feel they are the ones who care for the dying. "Dr. Death" is DW2 putting the lethal injection, like a whirlpool "going to the center". The others, like Nessus, Pholus and 1995GO, are "de-centering", like Neptune vertically instead of horizontally, like "perpendicular" Neptunes.. 1994TA is explosive (could be Eurythion), whereas SG35 is crazy but younger, like "Chiron Jr.". /Juan ______________________________________________________________
Message: 12
Centaurs are peculiar, they form a category. This peculiarity, from my present perspective (which will be maturing with time), is well represented in the mythic image of a warrior. I cannot see them as integrative in any way, since, in my opinion, integration is not their job. I don't see how I can relate wholeness with an asteroid, which by its nature incarnates fragmentation. The regained wholeness comes from other parts of the chart, in my view represented by the luminaries and by Jupiter and Saturn. Not even Chiron, so often associated with "healing" has anything to do with wholeness. Healing is, of course, but to me the Centaurs represent the pain and the crippleness that brings about the need for healing, the search and longing for wholeness, by showing us what is most human: fragmented life in need of redemption. ... I cannot see all this in a centaur. "Otherness" may be related to Centaurs, but, in my perspective, as I just said, they won't balance anything. They catalize. My very personal, subjective feeling in this, is that I cannot leave planetary hierarchy behind, and give Centaurs the same level of meaning the planets have, or give the planets the same level of meaning the Sun and the Moon have. I still don't see what difference do you make between centaurs and planets, or between planets and the Sun or Moon; I just perceive that you give a lot of weight to the centaurs, which produces in me the feeling that I'm loosing sight of the relative weight among planets, asteroids, and luminaries. To me, planets and centaurs have very different weights. This is only my perspective. It doesn't mean that I don't value others, but that sometimes they are more difficult to understand, or understanding them takes me more time. /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 6
... Don't forget the "hollowness" of the cave, surrounded by mineral but "hollow" and "rounded" inside. Like a womb, also like a skull, or a horn... in the hollowness astral and spiritual forces concentrate... (like the healing miracle at the end of "Ben Hur" I was just thinking that this could be related to several centaur orbital characteristics, and I do believe that all centaurs (and Pluto, of course) are hierophants in some way. Think, for example, in "The Never Ending Story" and the voyage of Atreyu through the Wasteland of Fantasia in search of the Nothingness, where he finds the Hunger-Wolf that is the only one that knows and explains the truth to him. The voyage through the Wasteland (like king Arthur's and T.S. Elliot's) seems to me related to the orbits of Nessus, Pholus, and 1995GO. Then, as he approaches the crumbling Queen's castle being devoured by the Nothingness, my mind thinks in the rounder orbits, the "hollow ones": DW2, CU26, and Chiron. Of course they are not "round", but they "surround" the void, the silence, the "in-betweenness" (I remember Jonathan using this word) that exists between the orbits of the two planets involved. The hollowness is also related to the "kenofocus", the "other", empty focus of the orbit, so that initiation happens when the planet "stands still" at Aphelion. I wish someone could illuminate more about this movie, one of the most enchanting and beautiful I have seen, arechetypal from beginning to end. And... remember the "gerflings" of "The Dark Crystal" (I think this was the name). I feel these characters are little centaurs waiting for us to explore their symbolism. I'm happy that I remembered these films. Just remembering them is so wonderful. /Juan ______________________________________________________________
Message: 2
John Ronald Reuel Tolkien was born in the late hours of January 3, 1892, in Bloemfontein, South Africa. There is an interesting pattern in this chart: Mercury = 0,05 Capricorn R.
So it seems that the centaurs are a recurrent presence in the fairy-tale stories. They are certainly good candidates for the inhabitants of Middle-Earth. A case could be made, as was suggested once by Zane with "The Wizard of Oz", where each of the main characters of the story is an individual centaur. Interestingly, the King or Queen of Darkness (Pluto?), always claims participation... /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 12
<<...A chubby, gentle, eccentric physician to animals, who learns the language of animals from his parrot, Polynesia, so that he can treat their complaints more efficiently. Much of the wit and charm of the stories lies in their matter-of-fact treatment of the doctor's bachelor household in Puddleby-on-the-Marsh, where his housekeeper, Dab-Dab, is a duck, and his visitors and patients are animals.>> [Britannica] Hugh Lofting, the author of the series, the best of which were written 1920-27, was born January 14, 1886, and died September 26, 1947. His Sun at birth, taken for 12 GMT, is in 24,19 Capricorn. The day he died, Pholus was in 22,50 Capricorn retrograde, indicating that it had been in conjunction with the Sun for several months until the time of his death. Since he was a writer, his Mercury should be significant. At birth (12 GMT), it is was 1,34 Capricorn (JV127 is also in 1,05 Capricorn, but we are not sure yet about this orbit). It is in inconjunct aspect (semisextile/quincunx) with a CU26/Pluto opposition in 1,58 Sag and 1,18 Gem respectively. (The Moon is in 1,43 Sag as I write this, hummm...) It is the day he died what makes his natal Mercury more signifficant: The Sun was (12 GMT) in 1,42 Libra, and 1995GO in 1,15 Cancer, thus becoming part of a T-square, with DW2 around in 1,02 Taurus. Hugh Lofting was a very remarkable man, a civil enginner by profession who had travelled widely but decided to become a writer. He developed the Dolittle character in the letters he wrote to his children from the war front in WWI. He hated wars, violence and cruelty. There is a grand trine at birth: Sun = 24,19 Capricorn
I believe that the centaurs, or Pholus/Nessus/1995GO ate least, are related to things such as inter-species communication and animal therapy, as far as modern science is concerned. /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 6
The time of King Arthur and the legend of the Round Table, Camelot, etc., would be the most perfect fit for the present orbit of Chiron, which there is no doubt in my mind is related to the Holy Grail, but, according to traditional accounts, it refers to the 6th century, i.e., about 4 revolutions of Chiron prior to 720 AD. The Swiss Ephemeris provides accurate positions from 650 AD. So, it wouldn't be unrealistic that at the time of King Arthur --if you believe such time really existed--, *our* present "Chiron" was beginning to appear in the Solar System. As a curiosity, the 2 most ancient perihelia of Chiron possible with the Swiss Ephemeris are June 661 AD, and the next is in December 716, making the period 55.5 years. This means that the semimajor axis of the orbit was farther away from earth, and Chiron was coming from the periphery outside of the solar system, as all centaurs are supposed to. Rique Pottenger's calculations had showed that Chiron had a close encounter in 718 AD, but he also found another very close encounter in the year 585 AD. His conclusion was <<that the position of Chiron is somewhat uncertain between 586 and 718 AD, and very uncertain before 585 AD. >> Therefore, the hypothesis that Chiron appeared in human history at the time given by tradition to King Arthur, has some ground. Symbolically, I think it is wonderfully perfect. The time of King Arthur is one Chiron revolution before 585. According to my encyclopedia, the 'Annales Cambriae' record the Battle of Camlann in 537 AD, "in which Arthur and Medrau Fell". Chiron appeared as soon as Arthur was gone. /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Message: 15
Mutual distances among the planets in space has never been a factor in astrological analysis. We interpret "angular" distances in a circle, which can be considered as horizontal distance. But the centaurs are orbit-crossers, they move vertically, in a way that the regular planets are not able to move. They come very close, like comets, and then go away to great distances, in many cases 20 times farther away than when they are closer. This is shown in the following examples, which show the dates of closest approach and of maximum distance between centaurs and planet and some examples of centaur-centaur distances, in the period 1701-2018. The numbers given are the distance in astronomical units, i.e., units of the mean Sun-Earth distance. Some interesting facts are: 1- Pholus gets closer to Pluto than to any other planet, and it gets closer to Pluto than any other centaur. 2- 1995GO(=8405) has a very close approach to Saturn in 1702 that probably has changed its orbit somewhat (same as SG35 in 1880) 3- DW2(=10370) gets closer to Pluto than to either Uranus or Neptune, or at least it gets as close to Pluto as it gets to Uranus. 4- Nessus gets closer to Saturn than to Uranus/Neptune/Pluto. But maybe, the corollary of this is that meaning is not found so much in the planets themselves as it is found in their orbits or "spheres" (That is, Nessus' orbit is more plutonian, regardless of the fact that it never gets close to the actual Pluto. /Juan _______________________________________________________________
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 07:11:16 -0600
"I said to my soul, be still, and wait without hope
--The Britannica says that "Four Quartets" was published in 1943, but the poems had been issued as a separate pamphlet each: Burnt Norton, 1941
T.S.Eliot was born September 26, 1888, in St. Louis, Mo., at 7:45 a.m. CST (from L. Rodden "Data News" #16, Astro-Data II, p.297): Moon = 14,22 Gemini
Asbolus = 27,48 Cancer
QM107 = 23,13 Libra
He died January 4, 1965, at the exact time of the Asbolus return (precession=1,04): Asbolus at death = 27,11 Cancer
Nort Node at death = 21,54 Gemini
he died also under a Merciry-Venus conjunction: tr. Mercury = 20,12 Sagittarius
a Chiron-Uranus opposition at death was squaring his Moon-Chariklo at birth: Chiron = 13,51 Pisces
Juan _______________________________________________________________
Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 07:40:16 -0600
also at death (corrected for precession 1,04 degrees), Nessus was at the Jupiter/Neptune axis: Jupiter at birth = 2,17 Sagittarius
So there are many exact centaur patterns (by exact I mean less than 1 degree). Tha patterns at birth are: 1- Moon opposition Chariklo (orb=35')
and the strongest patterns at death are 1- died at his Asbolus return (orb=37')
Juan ______________________________________________________________
Message: 2
Most of you will remember the great Alaskan oil spill of 1989. Ellie Bach in her "Planet atch" (Apr. 1989) had made a chart for it based on information in the N.Y. Times Tue. Mar. 28, where they reportedly say that the tanker struck the reef Friday March 24 at 12:04 a.m. in Prince William Sound near Valdez, Alaska. This time was just 7.6 minutes of time after Pholus had set in the Western horizon (the real physical Pholus, not its zodiacal counterpart), and 4.2 minutes before TO66 reached its lower culmination below the horizon. Projected in the zodiac when drawn in the chart, these planets show interesting configurations: Pholus = 9,37 Gemini
I believe this is one of the signatures of the accident, made more suggestive here by the presence of Pylenor. And regarding TO66: M.C. = 20,48 Virgo
So Ophion and TO66 in conjunction over the I.C. is the other signature of the event, or, if we prefer to ignore TO66 for the moment and stick to the centaurs, we then have a very tight Ophion/Nessus opposition over the meridian. The Sun is also aspected exactly by centaurs: Sun = 3,42 Aries
This Sun/Hylonome aspect is, in my opinion, still another signature of the event (I feel inclined to disregard SG35 as a centaur). Hylonome is important also because it is in conjunction with the Lunar Node in 4,39 Pisces/Virgo. Seeing these aspects, perhaps one can conclude that the Alaskan spill, one of the largest and most deadly oil spills in history, was a centaur tragedy, or better, a centaur catastrophe. Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 7
At 19:50 11/19/1999 , Zane wrote:
I am no expert in political astrology, but this is the event that has more meaning for me as a radix. Sun = 2,57 Sag
--We can see Pluto, Nessus, and now Chiron passing over this. Perhaps Chiron has to do with this question of secession (Russian astrologer Roman Brol observes that <<at least Chiron is very influential in history of states and nations. In particular, in British history ALL significant horoscopes of deprivations of colonies has connection between Chiron, Mercury and Neptune>>) ...although here with Mars it is acting more on the side of sheer destruction! the following is also interesting that date: Neptune = 12,50 Cap
here is a Jupiter/Hylonome opposition going on right now, with Jupiter retrograde, in square with the Chiron of this radix in 27,06 Cancer. And as mere coincidence, as I write this, the Moon is in exact conjunction with TL66 of the proclamation of independence (20 Aries)! This date would put radical Venus in 8 Sagittarius, now being "raped" by Pluto... But perhaps none of these dates is *the* date of Chechenia. The Britannica says: "The Republic was formed in 1936, after the amalgamation of the Chechen and Ingush autonomous oblasti (administrative regions), but when the Chechen and Ingush were accused of collaboration with the Germans during World War II, they were exiled to Central Asia [***NOTE: this "exile" is to me a Pholusian thing***] and the A.S.S.R was dissolved. The exiles were returned and the republic was reestablished under Krushchev in 1957." it later says: "Traditionally independent, the Chechen and other Caucasian tribes long resisted Russian conquest, especially in the 19th Century... (...). The Terek River remained a Cossack defensive frontier until the 1860's. The constant skirmishes of Chechen and Russians along the Terek form the background to 'The Cossacks' by Leo Tolstoy." Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 2
[...] Christopher Reeve was born 25 Sept 1952 at 3:30 a.m. EDT, 73W57/40N45 (from Louis Rodden ABC, 1980): Jupiter = 20,35 Tau r
this may represent the extra-terrestrial "Iron Man" very well. It gives an image also of the "casket" of his body, disconnected from the Sun (no aspect) but at the same connected with it (Leo) through a titanic (Pluto-Jupiter-TL66) will power that allows him to still work his body after the smashing disaster (TL66). Of course this is combined with: Hylonome= 12,13 Tau r
This is (the Moon) Louis Lane and other women characters like the one he fell in love with from the past in "Somewhere in Time", and his own wife now (Moon-Hylonome). You have to be Hylonome (sacrifice and surrender for beauty and love) to appreciate the role of his wife now... and I think is a testimony also of the importance of the quincunx aspect (when it is very exact). And, as I have mentioned here and elsewhere in the past: Iris = 2,08 Lib
The Iris "rainbow" is the tiny thread that joins his head to his body, and also a good sign of his characteristic "Clark Kent" softness or gentleness. The trine with QB1 can be seen as his ability to communicate from "otherworldly" (like Superman from the North Pole, or himself from the "above his body-casket" today). Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 6
>Howard Phillips Lovecraft, born August 20, 1890, @ 9:00 a.m. Eastern
Standard
I get the following for his Moon rising in Libra: TO66 = 21,03 Libra
In my opinion the "underworld" is the territory of the trans-Neptunian planets. I propose that TO66 (period=288 yrs) and TD10 (period=1024 years) are the main reason for Lovecraft's obsession with terror and mystery, and not the centaurs. XS35, if correct and not changed by future orbit modifications, gives a good description by his being "visited" by the source of his inspiration (the terror or ghost- presence that comes and goes), while Iris may be his refined artistic or literary imagination. Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 10
>Stephen King, born September 21,
In the case of Stephen King the centaurs seem to be more present: Hylonome= 2,01 Tau r
Perhaps this talks about the "gothic" nature of the centaurs, as opposed to the trans-Neptunian "underworld". It would be interesting to make a comparison between Lovecraft and King in this respect. Pluto = 14,15 Leo
...same thing here. The emphasis of Mercury as opposed to Lovecraft's Moon is notorious. Here we have the Mercury/Pylenor "trigger". --------------------
Pholus = 23,45 Cap r
Here is a trans-Neptunian signature: Mars is opposing the triple conjunction of Pholus-QB1-TO66 (and the Sun in 27,30 Virgo is making a trine to it). TF35 in the middle making a tight T-cross. Now we have a strong Mars (violence/sex) involvement... Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
[Yael] wrote:
I feel that Moon/TO66 is probably the best explanation of this. And as suggested by what Yael said, it is also a sign of a neuro-emotional immaturity. He died March 15, 1937 (age 47!). Nessus and Asbolus seem to stand out at his death: Nessus = 26,05 Aries (prec.corr.)
This means that he died just after a Pluto/Nessus transit over his trans-Neptunian horrified and macabre Moon, when Nessus was aligned with the rising UG5 that "closed" the birth Lunar stellium. We also find: Asbolus at death = 27,45 Taurus
Asbolus is "mystery" and "mist", while Nessus describes his extra-terrestrial monsters. So apparently Asbolus gives us another clue at the time of death. Some quotes from the Britannica: <<He made his living as a ghostwriter and rewrite man and spent
most of his life in seclusion and poverty.>>
These 2 comments in my opinion show 1- the birth situation of his Moon (poverty and seclusion, nightmares...) and 2- the poetic and literary string of the Moon. Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 9
Clyde Tombaugh himself tells the story of how and when he found Pluto in "Out of The Darkness: The Planet Pluto", co-authored with Patrick Moore (New American Library, Mentor Book, 1981). In page 126 he gives the approximate time of "4 p.m." MST, but the date is February 18. It is the time when he was examining the photographic plates and realized he had found the new planet. The date March 13 corresponds to the public announcement of the discovery by the Lowell Observatory, and was chosen to coincide with the 149th anniversary of the discovery of Uranus and the 75th anniversary of Percival Lowell's birth. The first photograph was taken January 21. The book does not mention the time when the more than 100 circulars were mailed on March 13, but it must have been first thing in the morning: <<The new secretary, Miss Constance Brown, and I ran the addressograph on the mailing envelopes, folded and enclosed the circulars, and put them in a box for the day of mailing. On 13 March, these circulars were mailed to observatories and astronomy departments all over the Unmited States and the world.>> (page 130-131) I personally would never consider the date of the first photographic plate. It was Clyde Tombaugh who made the discovery weeks later when examining a pair of plates taken January 23rd and 29th. He gives a very detailed description of the events of February 18th. For example: <<A terrific thrill came over me. I switched the shutter back and forth, studying the images. Oh! I had better looked at my watch and note the time. This would be a historic discovery. Estimating my delay at about three minutes, it would place the moment of discovery very close to four o'clock... For the next forty-five minutes or so, I was in the most excited state of mind in my life.>> (page 126). So let's see what we find in terms of centaurs and tnp's: February 18, 1930, 4 p.m. MST, 35n12.5/111w41
As a curiosity, the bomb at Hiroshima shows some amazing links to this chart. Corrected for precession from Pluto's discovery (13'), these are the exact positions (23h15m30s Aug 5 1945 in Greenwich): Mars at discovery = 9,28 Aquarius
Sun at Hiroshima = 12,55 Leo
Pluto at discovery = 17,46 Cancer
M.C. at discovery = 23,14 Aries
Pylenor at Hiroshima = 8,10 Cancer
Amazing! Juan ________________________________________________________________
Message: 1
"In the direction of" is meant both astrologically (from the chart) and psychologically (just assumed by the chart). It is determined by the weighting (strength) of the planets. In Lovecraft the tnp's like TO66 and TD10 are emphasized, and in S. King the centaurs seem to be stronger. In the case of Dali, the centaurs appear more clearly when one examines the death chart, especially Asbolus. Juan
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